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Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

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Yosuke Hayashi compares Wii U to rival consoles

In the days building up to the Wii U US launch, Team Ninja's Yosuke Hayashi has praised the power of the Wii U.

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Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 13 Nov 2012, 12:39

We need a Peter Snow swingometer for the "it's more powerful", "it's less powerful" news.
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Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby Lewis Daisley » 13 Nov 2012, 12:41

i'm not to fussed on its graphical power, buts its great that it can apparently run 1080p "easily."
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 13 Nov 2012, 12:49

Lewis Daisley wrote:i'm not to fussed on its graphical power, buts its great that it can apparently run 1080p "easily."


The 360 and PS3 (and the Xbox and PS2, actually) can run 1080p "easily".

The important bit is how much it can throw around in 1080p, which is determined by graphical power - so you actually *Are* fussed by that :)

It's now been confirmed that NSMBU doesn't run in 1080p, for what it's worth.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby mushroomchow » 13 Nov 2012, 14:13

For the most part, 1080p isn't the be all and end all for me. My telly at Uni runs 720p, which is still mighty fine and i believe every game will run that.

That 1080p plus all the processing power can combine so well is good news though. Certainly, I can't wait to hook it up on the massive telly at home. 8)
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 13 Nov 2012, 15:15

Yeah, my TV is only 720p too.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby Lew3107 » 13 Nov 2012, 18:46

I'm really looking forward to Ninja Gaiden 3: Razor's Edge in January. I'll pick it up after my first AS exams are completed.
It's nice to hear more good news from developers about the Wii U, and hopefully their support will continue.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby Mr Roboto » 13 Nov 2012, 20:55

Of course the Wii u is more powerful than current generation consoles including processor power running the game pad.

It would be financial suicide to release a console less or of equal power of PS3 and 360. HD graphics is going to be standard on home consoles now days any thing less would be laughed at!

The 720 is going to be announced at next years E3 with launch next Christmas time. Granted it will be more powerful than Wii u but there is a financial limit game makers have on developing AAA games so having extra powerful is not always used in a consoles life cycle.

This is my opinion but all current AAA titles on PS3 and 360 look amazing to me so games looking slightly better on Wii u will be great. I would be very surprised if the PS4 and 720 will be used to its technical limits.

One important thing is the Wii u has 1 year head start of being the most powerful console on the market which should boost sales if Nintendo play their cards right with a steady flow of games and good advertising.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby Lonegamer » 13 Nov 2012, 21:19

Just watched the ign review for ninja gaiden razors edge and it looks quite bad with no AA and muddy textures.
On a good point, it got a better review than the older version on 360 and ps3.
Im starting to think the wii u is not as strong as i thought it was going to be.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 13 Nov 2012, 21:59

Mr Roboto wrote:One important thing is the Wii u has 1 year head start of being the most powerful console on the market which should boost sales if Nintendo play their cards right with a steady flow of games and good advertising.


That worked out well for the Dreamcast.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby Mr Roboto » 14 Nov 2012, 00:35

deKay wrote:
Mr Roboto wrote:One important thing is the Wii u has 1 year head start of being the most powerful console on the market which should boost sales if Nintendo play their cards right with a steady flow of games and good advertising.


That worked out well for the Dreamcast.


You can't compare the Wii u's potential future to the Dreamcast failed past that's just retarded!!!

Nintendo needs a healthy flow of good exclusive releases the first year to tempt people who might be considering PS4 or 720.

This rival free first year is going to be extremely vital to Wii u to allow Nintendo to get ahead in sales figures. As the 720 is rumoured to have a similar gaming tablet controller as Microsoft recent patents suggests. Given the amount of money that Microsoft has at its disposal a years head start is going to be useful.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby LavaTwilight » 14 Nov 2012, 08:49

Mr Roboto wrote:
deKay wrote:That worked out well for the Dreamcast.


You can't compare the Wii u's potential future to the Dreamcast failed past that's just retarded!!!

Nintendo needs a healthy flow of good exclusive releases the first year to tempt people who might be considering PS4 or 720.



Plus also they didn't turn round and say "oh and by the way, it's released today"
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 14 Nov 2012, 09:22

Mr Roboto wrote:You can't compare the Wii u's potential future to the Dreamcast failed past that's just retarded!!!


I'd appreciate not being called retarded. That's most offensive.

You can compare them:

They're both early on the next generation.
They both have a second screen.
They both have a new type of controller (in the Dreamcast's case, it had analogue triggers).
They're both less powerful that the already announced successors to their rivals.
They're both going to be reliant on the maker's own game series' (for the DC - things like Virtua Fighter, Sonic, Crazy Taxi, etc.) rather than third parties.
They're both doing new things with online connectivity.
They both have a proprietary disc format.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 14 Nov 2012, 09:23

Oh, and the DC did have a steady flow of good games and loads, and loads, of advertising.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby K-tet » 14 Nov 2012, 13:11

deKay wrote:The 360 and PS3 (and the Xbox and PS2, actually) can run 1080p "easily".

This somewhat bothers me. You've neglected to mention both Wii and GameCube in this deliberation of yours, and that's where you've lost credibility. While it's arguable that the graphics prowess in the older 6th Gen systems can indeed deliver 1080p graphics, forgetting the GameCube (6th Gen) and Wii (7th Gen) (both with similar chipsets which can do 1080p output, look at Dolphin for more info) makes this point of yours completely moot. You also have to take into account how the systems are connected. I don't think SCART or Composite can do anything higher than native 480p/576i, but Component and HDMI obviously can hit 720-1080p/i. Also, HD was very new and not really a mainstream standard back during the 6th Gen, so yeah, point completely mooted.

For what it's worth, the 360 really does struggle to output 1080p graphics. About 5% of PS3 games are 1080p, and those are mostly PSN only games rather than games you can buy on a disc. Full HD is something those two systems weren't looking to achieve to do, whereas the option is there from the get-go should developers wish to take advantage of it on Wii U. Remember, Wii U can do it 'natively', so no up-scaling from 720p.

deKay wrote:It's now been confirmed that NSMBU doesn't run in 1080p, for what it's worth.

This hasn't been confirmed per se, as multiple sources are saying six of one and half-a-dozen of t'other. Until the game is widely available to the public, we won't know. I'm a glass half-full kind of guy so I'm hopeful it'll run in 1080p. It doesn't matter that much though, it's a 2D scrolling platformer. Nintendo always create beautiful visuals (as did Sega during the Dreamcast era actually) so that'll more than make up for it if you're a bit of a connoisseur for eye candy.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 14 Nov 2012, 13:31

K-tet wrote:This somewhat bothers me. You've neglected to mention both Wii and GameCube in this deliberation of yours, and that's where you've lost credibility. While it's arguable that the graphics prowess in the older 6th Gen systems can indeed deliver 1080p graphics, forgetting the GameCube (6th Gen) and Wii (7th Gen) (both with similar chipsets which can do 1080p output, look at Dolphin for more info) makes this point of yours completely moot. You also have to take into account how the systems are connected. I don't think SCART or Composite can do anything higher than native 480p/576i, but Component and HDMI obviously can hit 720-1080p/i. Also, HD was very new and not really a mainstream standard back during the 6th Gen, so yeah, point completely mooted.


No, you've totally missed the point.

I was explaining that you don't need a powerful machine, necessarily, to do 1080p, and pointed out some machines with lower power than the Wii U that could also do 1080p.

My point was you needed a graphically powerful machine to shunt fantastic graphics around at 1080p, but actually doing 1080p isn't difficult or expecially taxing.

K-tet wrote:
deKay wrote:It's now been confirmed that NSMBU doesn't run in 1080p, for what it's worth.

This hasn't been confirmed per se,


Nintendo have explicitly stated that it does not run at 1080p, and removed all references to it doing so from their publicity material. If that isn't confirmation, I'm not sure what is.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby K-tet » 14 Nov 2012, 15:36

deKay wrote:I was explaining that you don't need a powerful machine, necessarily, to do 1080p, and pointed out some machines with lower power than the Wii U that could also do 1080p. My point was you needed a graphically powerful machine to shunt fantastic graphics around at 1080p, but actually doing 1080p isn't difficult or expecially taxing.

Actually you've contradicted yourself. Raw power and Graphical power is still power in the long term.

Let me help you here and let's distinguish the two by saying CPU power and graphical prowess to help the distinction. In order to output 1080p graphics, it's all dependent on the graphics card and its capabilities. Yes, you need the CPU power to help drive it, but ultimately it comes down to the graphics card. I could have a PC as powerful as a 360 with a graphics card that doesn't support a resolution higher than 800x600. I can do 576i within that resolution as it works out as 768x576 on a 4:3 ratio. It won't be able to support any resolution higher than 800x600 irrespective of the fact that my PC has the CPU power to do so. Alternatively, I could have a PC as powerful as the original XBOX with a graphics card that supports a resolution of 1920x1080. What does that say? 1080p right? Because it's on a 16:9 ratio. Whether or not my PC can output video smoothly is down to the CPU power, but graphically, it's there and it's possible. It's common sense. Also, I should say at this point it's also based on the graphics and textures from the source. You can upscale the graphics to fit the new resolutions, but you'll be losing out on quality. Seeing an 720p image upscaled to 1080p compared to a native 1080p image shows a noticeable quality difference. If you're big on eye candy, 720p upscaling can be ugly.

Remember, the CPU has to do a multitude of different things, as well as all the graphical work. Where the Wii U is more advanced than the other 7th Gen systems is that the Graphics Card has its own CPU (known as a GPGPU) to help free up more resources on the main CPU. This also allows Wii U to output 1080p natively without cutting down on available resource power, as well as run games smoothly in 1080p without compromising on the main CPU.

Hope that helps your understanding. I knew what you meant, but it's easy to get confused. ^^
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 14 Nov 2012, 15:38

We don't appear to be saying different things, just using different words.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby K-tet » 14 Nov 2012, 15:55

I think you're right. But just for layman's sake, think of this as a Train and Carriage situation (using Thomas the Tank Engine for this comparison as most people know what it is and what engines feature). Say the CPU of a system is a Steam Train and the Capacity of these Carriages is the Graphics Capabilities. Let's say each carriage holds 120 people (as that's divisible into both 600 (5) and 1080 (9)) relating to the number of horizontal pixels (as displays nowadays are measured by that for consumer convenience, rather than say 800x600 or 1920x1080). Let's say the 360's processor is Gordon, a very powerful and fast steam train, and the XBOX is more like Edward, not quite powerful but still a stalwart. Gordon could pull five carriages into a station to allow a maximum of 600 people to board, but would be no good if there are 1080 passengers waiting to board. Gordon can easily pull these five carriages. Edward could pull nine carriages into a station to allow a maximum of 1080 passengers to board, but might struggle to pull those carriages once filled due to the weight, but won't have too much of a problem if say only five carriages were filled. The power of the engine needs to be able to pull the coaches. If the coaches have reached maximum capacity, no further passengers can travel. If the engine can't pull the coaches, the passengers can't go anywhere. See the correlation? The CPU has to be able to drive the graphics card, likewise the graphics card must be able to support the resolution required. The two go hand-in-hand.

I feel it necessary to break it down into layman's terms so that those that might not have an idea on what we're talking about have a rough idea of what it all means. You can blame the Expert Witness within me. Defending reports in a court of law is a stressful yet well paid position. You can direct any complaints to PM. For now, I shall stop.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 14 Nov 2012, 16:35

Thomas the actual Tank Engine analogies.

:lol:
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby Mr Roboto » 14 Nov 2012, 21:30

deKay wrote:
Mr Roboto wrote:You can't compare the Wii u's potential future to the Dreamcast failed past that's just retarded!!!


I'd appreciate not being called retarded. That's most offensive.

You can compare them:

They're both early on the next generation.
They both have a second screen.
They both have a new type of controller (in the Dreamcast's case, it had analogue triggers).
They're both less powerful that the already announced successors to their rivals.
They're both going to be reliant on the maker's own game series' (for the DC - things like Virtua Fighter, Sonic, Crazy Taxi, etc.) rather than third parties.
They're both doing new things with online connectivity.
They both have a proprietary disc format.


It's still different!

One major factor is Sega lost a lot of hardcore Sega fans before the Dreamcast was even launched due to the Mega CD and 32x add on and the Saturn!

Sega was already in financial trouble when making the Dreamcast console!

Software piracy was so easy with the Dreamcast games!

The Dreamcast did not support DVD like PS2 which helped the PS2!

Another killer for the Dreamcast was no EA games support!

The Dreamcast was doomed before it was ever released so how can you compare it to the Wii u you monkey!

Case closed!
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 14 Nov 2012, 21:51

I didn't say they were exactly the same! There are definitely parallels though.
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Re: Wii U has plenty of power - Team Ninja

Postby deKay » 14 Nov 2012, 23:55

In fact, how do we know the Wii U won't be easy to pirate games for?

The Wii U won't support bluray (which will help the PS3 and presumably the PS4, by your logic).

And, although not in trouble, Nintendo did report this year has been their first ever financial loss.

So yeah - even more in common.
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